So, if you guys aren't already aware CS:GO gambling is no longer allowed, and valve have asked all websites to cease operations. Many of you might not know about many youtubers being exposed for owning these gambling sites and not claiming it/denying they own the websites and stealing a LOT of money from the CS:GO community. These youtubers includel;
TheSyndicateProject (CSGOlotto)
Phantoml0rd (CSGOshuffle)
Tmartn (CSGOlotto)
MoE (csgodiamonds)
And The FaZE clan but nothing is confirmed
These individuals all (or more or less) claimed to having ownership is some way or another of these websites, gaining money from them but also claiming it was all "Luck"
moE knew the percentage that he would win when he bet, provided by the site.
phantoml0rd also knew the percentage of his chances of winning when he bet on the website too.
Syndicate had part ownership of csgolotto and Tmartn was the founder of it, together they made ALOT of money.
Although some of these youtubers have apologized, it's safe to say sorry doesn't pay back all of that money they scammed many people. I don't know everything about the entire situation, but i know evidence for many of these cases have been given, although im not entirely sure screenshots are a reliable evidence and i don't think those can be used against them.
What do you guys think about this? Do you think they should get prison time or just a slap on the wrist and a fine? Personally i think it's digusting what they did, they knew the were stealing money and i even thought Tom was a nice guy.
Post your thoughts guys! I probably have missed out a ton since i just woke up lol so feel free to add!
07-24-2016, 02:15 PM (This post was last modified: 07-24-2016, 02:16 PM by Eclipse.)
It should have never been a thing, online gambling for real money in the states (Nevada and New Jersey are legal) is illegal, and this is a form of online gambling seeing how the skins hold real money value.
Just like how Draftkings and such got shut down too since it was a form of online gambling, except these are for skins, which isnt much of a problem for the government.
(07-24-2016, 02:15 PM)Eclipse Wrote: It should have never been a thing, online gambling for real money in the states (Nevada and New Jersey are legal) is illegal, and this is a form of online gambling seeing how the skins hold real money value.
Just like how Draftkings and such got shut down too since it was a form of online gambling, except these are for skins, which isnt much of a problem for the government.
However, the skins do not OFFICIALLY hold real monetary value. There is no first party way to turn skins into real world money via steam. Steam wallet currency =/= real world money. You can't use steam wallet cash to go out and buy something in the real world.
If skins had true monetary value people would have to pay taxes on them if they sold them via steam, and just opening cases would be online gambling because it's similar to slot machines.. That's the loophole, and why it was never that big of a deal for people of age to do it. It only became a big deal because of the scumbags, and parents that let their kids use their credit cards to buy skins who then proceeded to gamble with them.
I had no major issues with it, people should be able to do what ever they want with their skins, but the gambling websites should've all confirmed the age of a person (some tried to), but then again, even on steam you don't have to be 18 to open cases.. But yeah, even valve never said it was illegal to do, they simply said it's against their ToS to use BOTS on their API to run a gambling business, they didn't say it was against it to use skins or any other steam Inventory items in such a matter.
Loophole = get LIVE people to accept the trades and manually deposit peoples skins for website currency. It would mean longer deposit/withdraw times, but technically it's not against steams TOS at that point. So I expect websites to pop back up pretty soon, I don't think the gambling scene is RIP'd just yet. I hope the scumbags are though.
@Brass: IMO you have to pay for keys or can even use the keys to gamble which I choose to believe it does hold value
I also believe Steam itself can be a first party way to turn into real money if they try hard enough but that is just my opinion.
(Didn't feel like making a huge quote post)
07-24-2016, 03:16 PM (This post was last modified: 07-24-2016, 03:16 PM by Brassx.)
(07-24-2016, 03:10 PM)Eclipse Wrote: @Brass: IMO you have to pay for keys or can even use the keys to gamble which I choose to believe it does hold value
I also believe Steam itself can be a first party way to turn into real money if they try hard enough but that is just my opinion.
(Didn't feel like making a huge quote post)
Well. Of course they actually have value to the player base, but I was just talking about the technicalities and how officially they have no real world value since you can't take money out of steam that you put into it. Without using 3rd party means that is. So as long as there is no first party way to turn the skins into money, they technically hold 0 real world value, 'cause again if they held true monetary value the users would have to pay taxes on their transactions on steam. Steam does not want their users to pay taxes on their virtual items, thus they will never make a first party way to turn items into real money.
(07-24-2016, 03:10 PM)Eclipse Wrote: @Brass: IMO you have to pay for keys or can even use the keys to gamble which I choose to believe it does hold value
I also believe Steam itself can be a first party way to turn into real money if they try hard enough but that is just my opinion.
(Didn't feel like making a huge quote post)
Well. Of course they actually have value to the player base, but I was just talking about the technicalities and how officially they have no real world value since you can't take money out of steam that you put into it. Without using 3rd party means that is. So as long as there is no first party way to turn the skins into money, they technically hold 0 real world value, 'cause again if they held true monetary value the users would have to pay taxes on their transactions on steam. Steam does not want their users to pay taxes on their virtual items, thus they will never make a first party way to turn items into real money.
Well, i mean call me a dumbass because i know nothing lol but just thinking about it, doesn't valve make 15% of what you sell on the steam market? So surely they do have SOME real world value if valve are making real world money off of it? Valve still leaves the loophole of allowing csgo betting sites to carry on AS LONG as they don't use automated methods..And if it was condsidered as a virtual currency that holds no real world value, then why would it be a problem? (Sorry I'm just trying to understand)
07-24-2016, 05:26 PM (This post was last modified: 07-24-2016, 05:27 PM by Brassx.)
(07-24-2016, 04:16 PM)[Phazz3] Cant Touch This Wrote:
(07-24-2016, 03:16 PM)Brassx Wrote:
(07-24-2016, 03:10 PM)Eclipse Wrote: @Brass: IMO you have to pay for keys or can even use the keys to gamble which I choose to believe it does hold value
I also believe Steam itself can be a first party way to turn into real money if they try hard enough but that is just my opinion.
(Didn't feel like making a huge quote post)
Well. Of course they actually have value to the player base, but I was just talking about the technicalities and how officially they have no real world value since you can't take money out of steam that you put into it. Without using 3rd party means that is. So as long as there is no first party way to turn the skins into money, they technically hold 0 real world value, 'cause again if they held true monetary value the users would have to pay taxes on their transactions on steam. Steam does not want their users to pay taxes on their virtual items, thus they will never make a first party way to turn items into real money.
Well, i mean call me a dumbass because i know nothing lol but just thinking about it, doesn't valve make 15% of what you sell on the steam market? So surely they do have SOME real world value if valve are making real world money off of it? Valve still leaves the loophole of allowing csgo betting sites to carry on AS LONG as they don't use automated methods..And if it was condsidered as a virtual currency that holds no real world value, then why would it be a problem? (Sorry I'm just trying to understand)
It's a problem because you do have to spend real money to get said items, but that doesn't mean those items are worth that much in return. Thus parents get pissed off when their kid turns 50 bucks into a skin and throws it away, and hears the kid crying about how they lost it. There's also the fact that alot of the scummy youtubers seemed to target children, with there VERY shady websites that borderline scam somepeople. They give kids the false belief that they can go there and come out with more than they put in. The people behind the lawsuits also seem to be misinformed and believe steam wallet currency is real money(when it's not), which is why valve had to state that in their statement. They are complying too to get the heat off of them.
Valve takes 15% to stop people from flipping as easily on the steam marketplace(buying some slightly cheaper and selling for slightly more. Without the tax, people could do this with everything and end up with a lot of steamwallet cash). The steam currency DOES give them profit in the end, because people have to pay real money FOR steam wallet cash in the first place. But you can't convert steam wallet money to REAL money within steam, making it have no real value in the outside world.
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