07-13-2017, 08:01 PM
In my experience on this server the rules do not cover a lot of the technicalities enforced by staff of the server. In making this thread I hope to accomplish a few rule changes, re-wordings, and potentially new rules to be added. Let me know your thoughts. The purpose of this suggestion is to make the quality of life for players much better and to reduce arguements or slays due to loopholes or accidents. Looking for genuine feedback as I feel these suggestions could improve the server if people agree with them. Thanks!
*** Most of these are clarification suggestions or questions ***
Rules:
NO META GAMING! Meta gaming is any strategy, action or method used in a game going against the game objective. Meta gaming is most simply defined as helping an innocent as a T or helping a T as an innocent.
Needed Clarification / Suggestion:
Include that trading during the round is not allowed. It is not very clear and tends to cause arguments when non staff members tell players no trade talk during round.
NO RDM! Killing someone based on suspicion, location, gun, player model, or any other questionable means are not allowed on this server ever. You must have proof! Logical killing is not RDM. (For example, there are 3 players left alive, 1 is proven, all others have been identified. It is logical for the last non-proven innocent to kill the last traitor being the only two “unproven” left.) If you see someone look at an unidentified body and ignore it you may kill them. However, if they simply walk near it and may not have specifically aimed at it you have to ask them to identify it before killing them.
Suggestion:
Sub-rule(?) for clarification:
You cannot kos off of location or gun: IE you MUST see people commit the crime to kos them.
The current rule says you cannot kos off of gun or location, but people do not understand that this means you must SEE the crime. I believe an example either somewhere on an official thread on the forums or a sub rule in the rules would help clarify this rule and prevent a lot of issues down the road.
Example: A person (Person A) leaves a room with an unidentified body (Person B) that you are entering, the body of Person B says they was killed by the same type of gun that Person A was using, and the body of Person B shows that it was killed within 10 seconds. Logically, we know Person A was most likely the T, but because of how the server handles logic, we cannot kos Person A because you did not physically see Person A kill Person B.
This is an issue mainly with newcomers as the veteran players have learned this technicalitiy and by posting an example I believe it will prevent a fair share of rdm or at least help players to understand what we mean by these rules. Coming from other TTT servers in my past, this rule was actually very difficult to adjust to in the beginning.
Perfect example: http://forerunnergaming.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=5784
NO TRAITOR BAITING! Shooting near someone, trying to prop kill, pushing someone near a ledge or any other dangerous area, hitting someone with your melee or doing anything else traitorous is considered traitor baiting. If you are proven and have acquired a traitor weapon you MUST state so in either text chat or voice chat. It is preferred you state so in both to avoid confusion but one or the other is fine. If you are killed for any of these reasons it IS NOT RDM. ATTEMPTED RDM is still punishable.
Clarification:
If you call out a Traitor weapon or secret knife - can you be killed for running near people while holding said knife or traitor weapon? I have been on many occassions and I consider this rdm, but people call it traitor baiting even when they acknowledge that it is the secret knife of the map. Clarification on something such as this can prevent rdm in the future!
Clarification:
There is a lot of traitor baiting I hear people talk about that is not covered in this rule definition. For example: Carrying a turtle around the map when the turtle is a known explosive t trap, or carrying an explosive barrel near any amount of people. Many people get killed for traitor baiting for these activites while being entirely unaware that these are infact considered. I think including things such as these either on an official post on the forums or as a change to the current rule would help in the future.
NO EXPLOITING! Getting under maps or in an area that is normally unreachable is not allowed! If you can see through a wall it is an exploit. Do not hack, glitch, or exploit in any way. This includes prop pushing, prop surfing, and door blocking. If you discover an exploit or bug please report it on our forums.
Clarification / Example:
When we all think of exploiting we think of "game breaking" exploits or glitches to get out of the map or make the game entirely unfair. I have on multiple occasions been told different stories on exploiting, and some of them just seem ridiculous to be called exploiting, so a clarification would be great??
Examples: Grapple hooking or prop surfing to where players cannot get normally. People get yelled at for this all the time, but then what would be the point of the grapple? (Prop surfing makes sense.) IE: Twin towers on ttt_rooftops. Top of the tower in ttt_sundaystreet. People go here with grapples all the time but staff won't bat an eye, yet if you go on top of a building in any other map most staff will call it "exploiting".
Another example that I think ISN'T exploiting but I've seen enforced and bans threatened by staff is a barnacle on teleport locations: For example the teleport to the tester basement on 6t7thway. Recently a player placed a barnacle where the teleporter brings you, and a staff member threatened the traitor because this was considered "exploiting". Personally, I don't see this as exploiting but rather using your wits to be a wise traitor.
Other times people yell "STOP EXPLOITING" would include door spamming on any given map, but especially during special rounds like infected or hunter. Exploiting refers to abusing the map for an advantage, but things like doors aren't really "exploitable" in my opinion. Still, it's scary to hear someone accusing you of a bannable offense when there's no real clarification. If special rounds require a different set of rules, why not add rules to the SPECIAL RULES section of the rules on the bottom containing these rules?
New rule suggestion:
NO KARMA BAITING! Players tend to t-bait for fun or to antagonize other players into draining their karma by killing them for "t-baiting". Examples of this would include when players shoot the ceiling and people can kill them for it under the pretense of t-baiting, and it results in rdm chains and countless arguments. If not the idea of the new rule, then clarification that obviously shooting the ceiling is not official t-baiting.
Clearly the actually wording / ruling for this would be re-worked but overall I wanted to hear people's thoughts on the idea as it tends to be an issue.
*** Most of these are clarification suggestions or questions ***
Rules:
NO META GAMING! Meta gaming is any strategy, action or method used in a game going against the game objective. Meta gaming is most simply defined as helping an innocent as a T or helping a T as an innocent.
Needed Clarification / Suggestion:
Include that trading during the round is not allowed. It is not very clear and tends to cause arguments when non staff members tell players no trade talk during round.
NO RDM! Killing someone based on suspicion, location, gun, player model, or any other questionable means are not allowed on this server ever. You must have proof! Logical killing is not RDM. (For example, there are 3 players left alive, 1 is proven, all others have been identified. It is logical for the last non-proven innocent to kill the last traitor being the only two “unproven” left.) If you see someone look at an unidentified body and ignore it you may kill them. However, if they simply walk near it and may not have specifically aimed at it you have to ask them to identify it before killing them.
Suggestion:
Sub-rule(?) for clarification:
You cannot kos off of location or gun: IE you MUST see people commit the crime to kos them.
The current rule says you cannot kos off of gun or location, but people do not understand that this means you must SEE the crime. I believe an example either somewhere on an official thread on the forums or a sub rule in the rules would help clarify this rule and prevent a lot of issues down the road.
Example: A person (Person A) leaves a room with an unidentified body (Person B) that you are entering, the body of Person B says they was killed by the same type of gun that Person A was using, and the body of Person B shows that it was killed within 10 seconds. Logically, we know Person A was most likely the T, but because of how the server handles logic, we cannot kos Person A because you did not physically see Person A kill Person B.
This is an issue mainly with newcomers as the veteran players have learned this technicalitiy and by posting an example I believe it will prevent a fair share of rdm or at least help players to understand what we mean by these rules. Coming from other TTT servers in my past, this rule was actually very difficult to adjust to in the beginning.
Perfect example: http://forerunnergaming.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=5784
NO TRAITOR BAITING! Shooting near someone, trying to prop kill, pushing someone near a ledge or any other dangerous area, hitting someone with your melee or doing anything else traitorous is considered traitor baiting. If you are proven and have acquired a traitor weapon you MUST state so in either text chat or voice chat. It is preferred you state so in both to avoid confusion but one or the other is fine. If you are killed for any of these reasons it IS NOT RDM. ATTEMPTED RDM is still punishable.
Clarification:
If you call out a Traitor weapon or secret knife - can you be killed for running near people while holding said knife or traitor weapon? I have been on many occassions and I consider this rdm, but people call it traitor baiting even when they acknowledge that it is the secret knife of the map. Clarification on something such as this can prevent rdm in the future!
Clarification:
There is a lot of traitor baiting I hear people talk about that is not covered in this rule definition. For example: Carrying a turtle around the map when the turtle is a known explosive t trap, or carrying an explosive barrel near any amount of people. Many people get killed for traitor baiting for these activites while being entirely unaware that these are infact considered. I think including things such as these either on an official post on the forums or as a change to the current rule would help in the future.
NO EXPLOITING! Getting under maps or in an area that is normally unreachable is not allowed! If you can see through a wall it is an exploit. Do not hack, glitch, or exploit in any way. This includes prop pushing, prop surfing, and door blocking. If you discover an exploit or bug please report it on our forums.
Clarification / Example:
When we all think of exploiting we think of "game breaking" exploits or glitches to get out of the map or make the game entirely unfair. I have on multiple occasions been told different stories on exploiting, and some of them just seem ridiculous to be called exploiting, so a clarification would be great??
Examples: Grapple hooking or prop surfing to where players cannot get normally. People get yelled at for this all the time, but then what would be the point of the grapple? (Prop surfing makes sense.) IE: Twin towers on ttt_rooftops. Top of the tower in ttt_sundaystreet. People go here with grapples all the time but staff won't bat an eye, yet if you go on top of a building in any other map most staff will call it "exploiting".
Another example that I think ISN'T exploiting but I've seen enforced and bans threatened by staff is a barnacle on teleport locations: For example the teleport to the tester basement on 6t7thway. Recently a player placed a barnacle where the teleporter brings you, and a staff member threatened the traitor because this was considered "exploiting". Personally, I don't see this as exploiting but rather using your wits to be a wise traitor.
Other times people yell "STOP EXPLOITING" would include door spamming on any given map, but especially during special rounds like infected or hunter. Exploiting refers to abusing the map for an advantage, but things like doors aren't really "exploitable" in my opinion. Still, it's scary to hear someone accusing you of a bannable offense when there's no real clarification. If special rounds require a different set of rules, why not add rules to the SPECIAL RULES section of the rules on the bottom containing these rules?
New rule suggestion:
NO KARMA BAITING! Players tend to t-bait for fun or to antagonize other players into draining their karma by killing them for "t-baiting". Examples of this would include when players shoot the ceiling and people can kill them for it under the pretense of t-baiting, and it results in rdm chains and countless arguments. If not the idea of the new rule, then clarification that obviously shooting the ceiling is not official t-baiting.
Clearly the actually wording / ruling for this would be re-worked but overall I wanted to hear people's thoughts on the idea as it tends to be an issue.